[Dáil Éireann] Proposal to allow TD's to leave the country
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by JGutenberg
This is the first installment in a series covering the going ons of the Dail Eireann. I know another TD has recently started up a similar series, however I have had this idea for a while before that and that was not my source of inspiration. Depending on how popular this is I'll write more.
Proposal to allow TD's to leave the country
Proposed by: Brendan C
Proposal:
“Hi,
At the minute if a TD moves region in-game they have to completely resign being a TD. I think that if somebody moves region, they obviously won't be able to vote in-game, but they should keep their private Dáil access and be able to propose laws and vote on the forums. So basically they would still be a full TD, they just can't vote in-game.
The main advantage of this would be that TD's could fight in important battles overseas, and still be able to perform their duties as a TD. Now obviously not everyone can avail of this, or else there would be nobody to vote in-game. Perhaps only 5 TD's can do this, and first time TD's can't do this either.
Each month a topic would be set up by the CC (or LCC) in the currently unused Dáil sign-in section. In this section people who wish to leave the country and still act as a TD on the forums would post saying "I want to leave for x reason" and the CC (or LCC) would either approve or deny the request by posting "@x Aproved/Denied".
Discuss.”
My vote:Tá/Yes. Some of our best fighters are also our best political minds. It’s simply not logical to harm our allies because of the false assumption that the two roles are mutually exclusive.
Requires: 50% + 1
Resolution: Failed.
Votes:
Tá/Yes: 7
Níl/No: 10
gonzo914 – Economic Free Thinkers Society Níl/No
CelticTiger211 – Saoirse Níl/No
Chris Cuthbertson – Labour - The Republican Party N/A
Octavius Dryst – Irish Union Party N/A
Paschoall – Irish Union Party Níl/No
Jeff Sullivan – Irish Freedom Party N/A
Connor O'Farrel – Economic Free Thinkers Society Níl/No
seanlynch –Economic Free Thinkers Society Níl/No
Edana Savage – Independant Voices N/A
Connell Rath – Eire Aontaithe Tá/Yes
Celsius – Irish Freedom Party N/A
MatthewBob – Irish Freedom Party N/A
Nithraldur – Irish Union Party N/A
Anthony Colby – Economic Free Thinkers Society Níl/No
orangejuicemmm – Irish Union Party N/A
oohaah10highfields – Saoirse Níl/No
Jster – Irish Union Party N/A
Commius – Eire Aontaithe N/A
Citizen woods – Labour - The Republican Party N/A
dartheleven – Eire Aontaithe N/A
Connolly James – Labour - The Republican Party Níl/No
MrConwayTwitty – Eire Aontaithe Tá/Yes
Dion de Brus – Saoirse N/A
absinthe12 – Irish Union Party N/A
Fear Malice – Labour - The Republican Party N/A
Eldarion Sionnodel – Labour - The Republican Party N/A
John Gormley – Irish Freedom Party Níl/No
mirek12345 – Eire Aontaithe Tá/Yes
Boris Tomic – Saoirse Níl/No
LordoIrish – Irish Union Party N/A
JGutenberg – Labour - The Republican Party Tá/Yes
Aghadoe –Economic Free Thinkers Society N/A
Ivan Blair – Irish Freedom Party N/A
Justori Bronzeg – Eire Aontaithe Tá/Yes
Brendan C – Saoirse Tá/Yes
Brian K – Irish Freedom Party N/A
James Ferrin – Nua Poblachtach Tá/Yes
Celticy – Irish Union Party N/A
Random fact: Interestingly enough, it appears as if all the high ranking members of the IDF voted no on this proposal.
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eLeft wing parties eworldwide are keen on mobilizing large amounts of citizens and not the elit only!
Nice piece Gutenberg,
A bit annoyed at the no. of N/A's though
I do not think that any of the No voters felt the two roles were mutully exclusive. But there were two strong arguments advanced against this measure, to wit: (1) In-game mechanics force resignation from the Dail in order to leave the country for any reason. The proposed change flies in the face of in-game mechanics. (2) Resigning from the Dail to leave the country, again whatever the reason, is a failure to live up to the commitment the TD made when he/she was elected. Don't try to dress it up with the rationalization that the TD was leavig to protect Armpit, Phillipines from the attacking forces of Turdistan. A pig in dress pants is still a pig. (Note that there was a number of IDF leadership on both sides of the question.)
Gonzo you should a huge lack of respect towards the Philippines by calling them an armpit. This isnt only to help them but what about Canada, the US or the resistance in Norway...are they also armpit nations in your eyes?
Voted and if I could vote id have voted yes.
I really wonder if these TDs are surprised to see that they can not leave country. This is nothing but legalizing those like Irish_Rebel_Reborn.
@Luminara -- No, it's not. It's allowing our high level IDF soldiers to deploy to help our allies and then return to Ireland.
Not at all Luminara.
The Dáil have really let this one slip by.
1. All votes passed in the Dáil voting process are passed in game, so it wouldn't have made a difference to the end process.
2. These rules make many great eIrelanders not want to run for congress as they know that they will not be able to train up their military skills. So Ireland loses out not only on their much needed expertise in the Dáil, but the ones who stay also lose out on military skills.
3. People like Irish_Rebel will always be around and this rule would not protect them anyway. This is because of Paschoall's new activity tracker. He's going to name and shame the people in congress who are not adding to any conversations. This will act as the measure to show who has been a good Dáil member and who has not!
So it should have passed imo. Some people got it into their heads that leaving the country to fight for an ally would be dishonest to the people that elected you. That might well be true if the congresspeople could not do their duty, but I have shown and it was also proven in the thread that congressmen could still fulfill their duties and fight...
Btw, Nice article Gutenberg 😃
Not to take away from any argument for either position because both sides have their opinion. Sometimes I think that with the attitudes of the losers of a vote they forget that the winners were just as sure they were right as you thought you were. This debate in particular is an opinion. There are no facts which would prove that leaving your post as TD is or is not breaking an oath. IT IS AN OPINION. No one is trying to destroy Ireland or bring dishonor to our nation. People, including me, voted our opinions. Don't take it personally. Everyone has an image of what Ireland and her government should be. I'm sure most of them are different from everyone elses. That doesn't make them wrong.
great Artilces
great Artilces
@JGutenberg, Connell Rath
As these TDs are technically no longer members of Dail and can not participate in voting process, it is almost like giving some people access to private Dail forum (let me assume these people are of Seanad Éireann). It is almost because only difference is the congressman medal and treasure map.
I also wonder if Paschoall's ACME 2010 TD-Buster will work as majority (20) simply not involved in even voting of this proposal. If an act becomes common, it no longer becomes a source of shame. This is why even the slightest attempt must be dealt with proper answer.
Good idea to write these articles.
In the past this just never came up. It was understood that TD's were immediately transferred to the Reserves.
This and proposals like it strike me as a return to over-legislation. Something we fought very hard to push down.
I prefer to fight as I please, when I please at any time. Ergo, I choose to not run for public office (and reserve the right to change my mind).
We haven't even broached the subject of how TD's leaving would effect the partisan balance in the Dáil. We already have various rogues and or new TD's who inadvertently or maliciously propose laws that have not passed the proper vetting...
What happens when Party 'A' has three congressmen leave to fight and Party 'B' recognizes their sudden majority and ability to undermine the democratic process?
Y'know this was intended to be a briefing of Dail activity to the public rather than an attempt to take the debate off the forums...
Luminara, you'll notice that the inactivity by in large came from only a certain few parties, although there were people who didn't vote from all parties. Also the technicality that players lose their congress privledges in game doesn't actually matter at all as I've proven in my other comment.
@Donavan, the parties would of course be in charge to make sure that they do not end up in a situation with no voters for in game proposals. The likelyhood of another group taking advantage of that is nil anyway.
This would never require much legislation or anything at all really.
The aim of it was to try and get the Dáil more active by encouraging players into congress and also to help our allies aswell as improving our own soldiers skills.
@Gutenberg- The beauty of the comments section is that they are not owned by the author, though sometimes I certainly wish they were!
@Connell, While I will concede the ability to help our allies, I really can't see this as anything other than a "have your cake and eat it too" proposal. No disrespect intended, perhaps I'm just hard line on "In the Dáil or Not". Then again, I think most of us oldtimers should get the hell out of the way for the young'ins.
I disagree about the nil chance of anyone taking advantage of the situation, I've seen many shady dealing around here and elsewhere.
(BTW, if you wanted to clue me in on pm, I'd love it. I don't want to clog up Gutenberg's article). If I'm missing something I'd love to see it.
I'm not in the Dáil this term, but to be honest in 5 terms as TD, I never once left eIreland.
I did the job I was elected to do, and if I want to leave the country, I won't run for Congress.
It is a big sign of disrespect to the country, to your party, and to those who voted for you if you leave in the middle of your term.
If you wish to leave the country to fight in battles, don't run for congress in the next election as a sign of respect to those who voted for you and who count on your representation of their votes.
-BA
interesting