Germany and our Foreign Affairs
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by DKN
Our relation to Sweden and ATLANTIS:
I have spoken yesterday to some Swedes and their MoFA and got a clear view from them. They want SH and nothing else. If we say no to SH then there will be no way for us to either have peace with Sweden or to join ATLANTIS.
This is really sad because talks with other ATLANTIS member were very constructive and ready to deal with us. BUT not only Sweden is against us - Poland would be against Germany, too as Romania would support the Swedish point of view.
Our relation to Hungary and PEACE:
Hungary seems not to be willing to stick to the agreement that we are able to unify with all Austrian regions. They block the region Burgenland where our two hospital companies are placed. This is absolutely not vital to our relation and it seems like the Hungarians playing a imperialistic game now.
We have good relation to most PEACE countries even after they have left PEACE like Turkey. We have bought a q5 hospital for 300g which needs to be paid back soon.
What happened the last days?
Hungary has put pressure on us and after I have spoken to Sweden it came clearly up that we are at a point where we need to decide between ATLANTIS and PEACE!
We need to decide because with Austria we are more vulnerable and we are right before some more wars in Europe which could hit us more than we expect at the moment. Germany is a key country in central Europe. Each alliance would be fine with Germany being member because of a domination in central Europe. So here are the options from my view:
What if we join ATLANTIS?
WE would have problems in the South because we would need support from all ATLANTIS countries to safe our Austrian regions against Hungary or Italy. To get that membership we would have to give SH away to Sweden and as mentioned would possibly loose Austria.
What if we join PEACE?
WE could get Burgenland and could finally end the Union with Austria. There would be no fear to our regions because of Italy and Hungary bordering us in the South and MPPing with them to protect SH and all of our German regions. We could get the hospital for free and would not be forced to pay the 300g.
We need to decide till the end of the week. Everyone that followed my political points knows that I have fought hard to get Germany a neutral country after our independence. I have been party leader in Sweden and want to have peace between us but not for every price. And the price for remaining neutral and or to join ATLANTIS is to high - unfortunately. We can wait till Thursday but I doubt that Sweden sacrifice their SH-clause to make us member of ATLANTIS. And so I can only propose the logicically option : PEACE.
This is an important step for Germany and I want you all to discuss it and try to do a poll at eGermany.de.vu to find out what all think before we do such a step. But if we have decided all together for one option then I want you all to work for that decision to make us a trustworthy and valuable member of our partners.
DKN
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"What if we join PEACE?
WE could get Burgenland and could finally end the Union with Austria. There would be no fear to our regions because of Italy and Hungary bordering us in the South and MPPing with them to protect SH and all of our German regions. We could get the hospital for free and would not be forced to pay the 300g."
Is this fact or just you wishing? I seriously doub that Hungary will change its mind just because we join an aliance with them. And even if they said so... they changed their mind already in the past, so why shouldn't they this time?
And what if Hungary doesn't help us?
Remember, they have yet to keep their word and give us Burgenland. I seriously doubt we can trust them with our entire survival.
In the grand scheme PEACE would be the best choice but both decisions make it seem like something bad is going to happen to us no matter what.
What about the resistance war going on in Burgenland?
We need war
The time for peace and pandering is over
How long are we going to let these weak fools dominate our lives?
We need revenge for all the atrocities of the past.
We must teach them that the only germany is a strong germany.
That the only europe is one dominated by germany.
The time is now. Wait no more.
Glory to the Reich.
Look at that Trackback!
Sweden has made posts in the past suggesting that if we join PEACE that they would attack.
You better know wtf you are doing because it very well might be the end of Germany-Austria altogether.
Nice pickle you guys have gotten yourselves into. Wow, that trackback is pretty aggressive. The Hungarians don't seem to dislike you quite as much, almost, but not quite as much.
It seems that half our problem is that our elected officials have been slow to try and grow our economy! Our currency may be doing relatively well, but with 30+% of inflation and 1DEM minimum wage, our people simply don't have enough money to spend on decent food, housing, and (arguable most important) weapons!
Ich denke, dass die Problem mit unsere Regierungbeamten ist: sie haben nicht die Wirtschaft gewaschen! Unsere Verbeitung ist gut, aber, mit 30+% Inflation und 1DEM Mindestholn, haben die Menschen nicht das Geld für anständiges Lebensmittel, Unterkunft und (am allerwichtigsten) Waffen!
Hungary was angered by the request of Germany to liberate Burgenland in the middle of the fight with Romania when Hungary was trying to regain its original territories - the RW split un Hungarian war effort because some Hungarians fought in that war. The contract stipulated that Austria will be invaded during a longer period, but Germany wanted all in one week.
Now Hungary uses Burgenland as a training ground, but has no interest to keep it on a longer term as it has nothing to gain from it.
If Sweeden will attack Germany, Hungary will help Germany with no question asked.
I'm quite curious to know what will be your final decision DKN.
I really hope germany doesn't choose again to let win cowardice and join Atlantis.
We as Peace have proven more than one time what we did for Germany. If Germany is free and exists again is because of us, not because of Atlantis.
Let see what your people will decide.
han solo, the room for bullshit like your words is the last door on the right 🙂
mappina, thx but I don't wanna be in the same room with you. I just don't like pasta smell, no offense 🙂
If other nations didn't hold such hostility towards Germany, maybe some issues could be worked out. The south seems like it just doesn't give a damn about what happens to Germany, and the north holds an unrelenting grudge.
Thanks Han Solo for represented the average romanian citizen.
Otherwise, Good luck Germany for you choise!
You should not chose alliance in order to be allied with those you are afraid shall attack you.
You should chose alliance based on who you want to be friend with.
@han, don't worry, in that room you will be alone, nobody tells bullshit like you do 🙂
@misho: wise man 🙂
Well, then it would be of course Italy that helped us several times from their first being in eRepublik till our independence. We own Italy something for being so kind to us - although I think the wc2006 is enough 🙂
This is just an example but it is like RL (marriage) you buy the whole bunch of an Alliance (family). I want to ally with Italy they are our friends and will let us win the next wc in South Africa.
@mappina: you're right. except you. You are full of it 🙂
peace seriously sounds like the better solution because the only threat if we join peace would come from sweden
even if both of the solutions don't sound perfect, we have to choose the lesser evil..
Okay lets see...
http://www.erepublik.com/en/article/new-borders-the-bridge-is-here--745317/1/20
http://www.erepublik.com/en/article/a-bridge-to-hell--744949/1/20
http://www.erepublik.com/en/article/day-449-of-the-new-world-and-what-a-day-it-was--733901/1/20
http://www.erepublik.com/en/article/wormtounges-must-not-rule-the-new-world-1-730443/1/20
http://www.erepublik.com/en/article/the-real-truth-of-the-egerman-leadership-1-721508/1/20
http://www.erepublik.com/en/article/german-plans-to-invade-the-czech-republic-reveled-1-720727/1/20
http://www.erepublik.com/en/article/germans-i-m-sorry-1-720485/1/20
http://www.erepublik.com/en/article/peace-gc-turns-germany-into-international-playground-1-720228/1/20
http://www.erepublik.com/en/article/regarding-the-eswedish-defense-systems-factory-in-egermany1-704784/1/20
..and those are only articles of good old "friend" misho
besides DKN... I am till waiting for an answer regarding my first post.
Repost:
"What if we join PEACE?
WE could get Burgenland and could finally end the Union with Austria. There would be no fear to our regions because of Italy and Hungary bordering us in the South and MPPing with them to protect SH and all of our German regions. We could get the hospital for free and would not be forced to pay the 300g."
Is this fact or just you wishing? I seriously doub that Hungary will change its mind just because we join an aliance with them. And even if they said so... they changed their mind already in the past, so why shouldn't they this time?
han, cmon, you can do better than just ping pong my answers.
try again dude 🙂
voted for PEACE in the eGermany forum.
I would prefere to stay neutral, but this means to become the next battlefield betwenn ATLANTS and PEACE. They would crush and split us. I think with PEACE-members we have had better relations in the past to build on in the future.
@GeBe what your post misses is the nature of the game. At the time of the Burgenland afair the Hungarian government pulled out all the stops to try to get people to behave, and paid a serious personal political price. But we are not a dictatorship and we can't just put soldiers to the wall and shoot them for insubordination. The citizens on average felt that what Germany was doing was unecessary and decided to vote with their feet. So what you did was antagonize the populace with your action then, and many haven't forgotten. and by commenting like that about the leadership, you continue to antagonize. That said, I think there is still plenty of room for German - Hungarian freindship, but not if you don't even try to understand anything from the Hungarian point of view. If you refuse to do that, what does that tell us about a long term friendship.
@DKN:
"WE could get Burgenland and could finally end the Union with Austria."
You need them to sign a contract with hefty penalty clauses (min. 500 gold). The last time we signed a contract with Hungary in good faith and without penalty clauses we got f*cked in the arse.
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@Zoli:
I am SICK AND TIRED of hearing your whining and phony excuses for your failure to return Burgenland.
The RW is *not* the issue.
The issue is that Hungary conquered Burgenland when it was not supposed to, and did not need to. Every consequence (RW, etc.) is the RESPONSIBILITY OF HUNGARY, and not the responsiblity of Austrian or German leaders. You and your people finally need to leave dreamland, fess up to this reality, and STOP INSULTING OUR INTELLIGENCE.
I love it when people comment with orgs
Stability and a strengthening the military in case of an attack from Sweden would be the way to go..
Never did like Vikings. Go with PEACE.
we have never betrayed our allies, unlike the romanians who did it several times, look up your history
chicco, with these comments for sure you would not help germany to have burgenland back, or PEACE to be as moderator in this affair 🙂
having said this, I hug you anyway strong 😛
Let´s join PEACE.
Sorry Mappina, although I respect ya, I whole-heartingly disagree with joining PEACE. What it comes down to is who do we trust, well, I don't trust Romania, and Sweden is usually fairly honest (just annoying). However, I completley trust the UK and Canada, they have shown themselves to be honorable nations consistantly.
I also recognize that Italy has been fairly kind to us on numerous accounts, even if the motives were geared towards gaining a PEACE power in central Europe. Regardless, what we do as a nation is up to us and considering the options of death or death, option 3 still sounds good. We have our friends, if they want to abandon us if we choose neutrality and continue our diplomatic course, so be it.
I'd rather be alone with a leg to stand on them be thrown to the wolves.
I always was in favor of staying neutral in this debate!
But I'm also no dreamer, I expected Germany to join PEACE ever since they helped us to our independence!
We showed great strength by staying neutral for as long as we did!
PEACE is the strongest Alliance and if they want us to join them, who can blame them.
I say, let's get this problem out of the way! And finally put our cards on the table.
Join PEACE
@Han:
"hehe, those hungarians did to you what they know best. lying and betraying ."
You forgot whining and mind-boggling hypocrisy.
Yes, such is PEACE. The wild west. A total sham
The total sham to whom u can kiss feets for freeing your country. Don't forget it.
Your fellowship are putting here lots of reasons to join one or the other alliance, or noone of both, and I accept all of them.
But not these offences.
"The total sham to whom u can kiss feets for freeing your country."
You only freed this country out of strategic interest. From what I have seen on the PEACE forum, I can assure you that there was not an ounce of altruism to it.
Further, you fail to address even a single of the concrete points that I raise. This is a typical response for you, but also for other PEACE "officials". You don't have the balls to stand up to an intellectual argument. All you manage are vague references to history or appeals to your in-game authority.
Here are a few question for you, bisiacco. In really simple "Yes/No" style, so even you might be able to answer them.
1. Did Hungary need to attack Burgenland? Yes or no?
2. Did Hungary need to conquer Burgenland? Yes or no?
3. Did Hungary violate contract? Yes or no?
4. Did Hungary get punished for violating contract? Yes or no?
5. Can Hungary do anything she likes with impunity? Yes or no?
6. Do you understand the term "rule of law"? Yes or no?
These answers should be obvious to anyone with half a brain.
ok chicco, as usual you cannot avoid offending other people.
so since I am sick and tired of your behavior, I tell you and other people here how things went.
1. you came up time ago with this story of the fusion with Germany
2. I told you that in the first attempt it is a good thing for Austria, because economy would be better, you would have more people, and companies in austria would only gain from this.
3. There is a "but" indeed. I told you that Germany at that time (as now) was not a peace member, so doing this Austria would have left the Alliance
4. You told me: "but mappi, I want to do it, people here wants to do it"
5. the meeting on the peace irc channel came. We asked you:"what you want to do then?" you replie😛 "we want to merge". We tried to convince you not to do it, or try to find a solution keeping austrian territories in the Alliance
6. You refused, giving reasons like the same language (although less than the half of eAustrian are german speaking people) and the same culture.
7. We told you:"Ok, do it, but you will manage everything by yourself. Here the Alliance will not interfere" you said that it was fine, and then the fusion started.
8. You made the contract on the forum. Fine.
9. The fusion started, then Hungary attacked Burgenland (and this was not needed, imo)
10. From that time on you started to PRETEND that PEACE should force Hungary to leave Burgenland, but it is time YOU face the reality chicco. As I ALWAYS told you in pm, you cannot give as a present a PEACE country to a non PEACE country, telling that you want to do it (so it is an internal affair) and suddenly, when things go wrong, PRETEND to be part of the alliance again.
11. You started it as your (austrian people) wish? well you finish things by your own. PEACE has nothing to do with it till Germany doesn't join the Alliance.
So, all the question that you made to bisiacco (offending him once again) you have to make TO THE ADMINS, AND NOT TO US!
is it clear now?
True Mappina except one major matter. You're trying to get us into PEACE and yet you defend Hungary's position on the matter. Not a very good selling point.
I fought with Peace, I was the defence Minister of Austrian Army, one thing i know Atlantis is a group of nation while Peace is a nation.
I saw a Country sacrifice them self for Peace, did you see that on Atlantis?
In the end you want to ask your self... vs who you want to fight ? Atlantis the destroyer of free world... or Peace which keeps the free world alive?
Atlantis has much bigger numbers... but Peace always managed to push them back.
Remember that Austria was always a Peace county.
where is the defense to hungary's position?
I wrote:
"then Hungary attacked Burgenland (AND THIS WAS NOT NEEDED, imo)"
that means I didn't find this attack right. and I also wrote it on the forum, but at that point there was nothing I as PEACE representative could do.
as much as I enjoy a good fight in the comments 😛
Is it just me or does that not really have anything to do with whether of not Germany joins PEACE.
This here seemes more like a private/personal problem between Chicco and PEACE!
@Metallion Is that what you call PEACE internal conflict? In case you haven't noticed Indonesia is fueled by war just as much as Romania is.
Atlantis and PEACE both have their villians, but they have their good guys too.
The point is, I never really expected PEACE to do anything material. I know that your hands are tied and that you have to kneel before the god of strength (Indonesia) and the god of numbers (Hungary). "SG" is just a meaningless tag to make someone feel important.
Having said this, there was one thing you could have done: state the obvious. State publicly that Hungary is a backstabbing, contract breaking, imperialistic aggressor. Which is precisely what it is.
Would this have made a material difference? No. Would Hungary have bowed to your verdict? No. What it might have achieved, however, is to not alienate and offend your former ally (Austria) and your potential ally (Germany).
And that is where I fault you.
You got the point, Gobba.
Chicco, with your reply to my post, you just showed 3 thing:
1. u need to insult to convince the world u are right, last post was my time.
2. u didn't get the point i was not arguing about your reasons, that can be considered valid, but about the way u are pushing ahead them, insulting.
3. Since u as minister of defence are an official representant of Germany, PEACE have to consider your attitude the attitude of Germany?
If yes, I just have some doubts on the opportunity to let Germany join PEACE. If no, It's not my interests to judge the choice of German President for his staff
Finally some clear statements regarding this Peace thing (from mappinia). Doesn't realy make the whole thing more atractive to me, but some information are better than none I suppose.
@Mappina "If yes, feel free to join Atlantis (at the cost of one of your regions btw, that is ridicolous)."
This isn't in reference to joining Atlantis, but we're still in negotiations to end the dispute over SH and we may find a solution fairly soon.
Personally, I'm leaning towards PEACE.
This would be a better solution for the Union with Austria, which obviously means a benefit to our nation as a whole, and with the resulting alliance with Italy, Hungary and Turkey, it would form a united southern front against possible attack from Sweden. And frankly, I would rather die than give up Schleswig-Holstein to the Swedes.
everybody in Germany who thinks if they joing Peace, Sweden will be the only threat:
You f**k with Sweden, you f**k with us, eRomanians! Even if Indonesia attacks us!
"If yes, I just have some doubts on the opportunity to let Germany join PEACE. If no, It's not my interests to judge the choice of German President for his staff"
Oh we're back to threatening now?
Are you going to pull your old trick again? The one you pulled back in Austria last year? Trying to blackmail the government into firing me? And when that doesn't work try to defame me over some other dirt you can dig up?
Why don't you think of something new? Like hacking into my eRep account... bribing the workers in my companies to resign... run for German President so you can fire me... you know, something creative, something original. Always the same cheap stunts over and over again, it gets kind of old, you know.
"u need to insult to convince the world u are right, last post was my time."
Actually, I use eloquence to carry my message. I just add insults as spice. My arguments are sharp as a knife, and your lame and vacuous retorts are but a thunderous testament to it.
"u didn't get the point i was not arguing about your reasons, that can be considered valid, but about the way u are pushing ahead them, insulting."
Yes, I've noticed you don't like to argue about reasons. You just like to provoke, libel, and malign.
DKN please rename this article to
"Chicco vs. mappina"
"I remember they asked you (and germany) one region for some time, because they needed it. you refused. why?"
Mappina, why don't you give me 1000 euros? I can email you my bank account number. And, hey, if you don't give it to me, I'll come over and steal it from you.
And if you dare to object, I will say: "you with your attitude are guilty as well!"
Do you not see how twisted this logic is? Is it a joke?
"I did for sure more than you never did for it."
You made great efforts, that is true. But nothing much came of it. Austria just went down the drain. This is something you cannot deny. I'm not saying it's your fault. But you also can't exactly claim you built a great nation or anything.
"I was in Austria fighting Serbs when Aanok was president. You were just making golds. then suddenly you decided to come back in austria. what did inspire you?"
Clean up your and Aanok's mess?
"Again, I repeat you. This is your internal affair. not PEACE one. Again you do the same mistake. Again and again."
Really, Austria was not in PEACE? You know, honestly, I can see your point. But in the end, it's just spin. Nice try evading responsibility basically.
Why don't you prove your point? If Germany-Austria enters PEACE, Hungary returns Burgenland. (From what I hear Hungary/PEACE isn't willing to agree to these terms.)
"How is it? we are fine we don't need you but oh, we are in the shit, yes WE NEED YOU!"
I can hardly be made responsible for previous administrations. Only because a Serbian TO effectively denied us participation in the alliance, we should now suffer the consequences? Tell me, is it a joke?
"you blame us we don't have rules, but you are the first in not following them. this is like above: when I need it I want the rules. when I don't like them I behave like they do not exist."
Really? Which rule(s) did I break?